Unlocking the Power of Diversity with Tristan Norton

Tristan Norton:
Go with your gut feeling. If you’re creative and you have a feeling of like, “Oh man, this could work,” just do it. And two things can happen. Well, three things. You can succeed, you can just be delayed or you can fail. And if you fail, you know what you did wrong and you just do it better the next time.

Mathieu Yuill:
Hey and welcome to the Leading With Nice Podcast interview series podcast. My name is Mathieu Yuill, and we want to help you inspire others, build loyalty and get results. Now today, as always, I’m very excited because not only do we have somebody who I know to be very thoughtful, to be a great leader, to be insightful, has the ability to overcome adversity, is resilient. But also he was a classmate of mine in my masters, in management and leadership, and we became good friends then, we’ve continued that relationship. He is based right now out of Saskatchewan. And if you listen regularly, I’m here in Toronto. But we enjoy a great relationship, sometimes via texts, sometimes via chat. But a Tristan Norton, welcome to the show.

Tristan Norton:
Thanks for having me, Matt. I’m really, really glad to be here today for sure.

Mathieu Yuill:
So I’ll just jump right into it. And again, if you listen to this show, I send questions in advance to guests because I don’t want them to be surprised. I want them to have had time to be thoughtful about the answers and put some time into their questions. I just want to be transparent on that. So Tristan, we’ve journeyed through a masters in leadership and management program together. So we’ve known each other for a while. However, recently we worked together on developing and launching the crisis in communications course at Briercrest Center for leadership studies online. You’re the director of the center and have been tasked with launching online learning where previously it had not existed, at least not in a robust way like you are developing. So in your role, what have you had to encourage Briercrest to both abandon, what beliefs or practices have they had to leave behind to do this as you launch this online learning?

Tristan Norton:
Well, to first answer this, I thought about this question quite a bit when I was preparing, and one of the things is that they already had online learning and distance education. One of my really good friends, Brian Westnedge, he is the director of the continuing and distance education here. So we weren’t really starting something new and different, but we’re starting something that I would say was more accessible to people in the sense that instead of doing a four year or two year masters degree online, people can do one-off courses in certain topics that were interesting to them.

Tristan Norton:
So that’s kind of why we set up the whole center for leadership studies, in my opinion, was to give that accessibility to individuals when they’re ready to learn more or do more personal development instead of paying for a full degree. So when it comes to what we had to have them abandon or change, I think they had to just change the outlook of the purpose of these courses. Instead of saying, “This is a full degree,” we had to change the thinking that these could be used as a stepping stone in our stepping ladder, if people wanted to go into further degrees. So they will be able to take these videos and watch these courses as a way to just take a little off the top of what they can get from some of these classes. If that makes sense.

Mathieu Yuill:
Yeah, totally. So basically what I learned is that if I had waited a couple of years, I could have a big lump of money and you find some online classes. I’m looking at the classes right now, and Paul Magnus, who is a brilliant professor at Briercrest, just released one called Organizational Health – How to be a leader others want to follow. It’s $59 like. Briercrest.online, you should go check this out. I’ve noticed as well, my course has moved off the front page.

Tristan Norton:
What do you mean it’s moved? It’s gone.

Mathieu Yuill:
When you go to the front page, it’s not right there. I’m not going to say that’s hurtful, but whatever, I got some Kleenex over there that I might have to get over. But I asked this question about what you’d have to abandon because listen, we’re recording this, we’re at the end of March, 2021, we’re still in COVID. There is a light at the end of the tunnel, but it is a pinhole size, and there’s been a lot of this, what I’m going to talk about now. And so I’m going to ask you about this. I asked that last question, because often when a business or a leader is starting something new, they have to leave their established toolkit behind, or at least a good amount of their tried and tested tools. So thinking generally of launching this brand new program, and I understand that elements existed, but for the most part it was a new thing. What would you tell a leader at another organization who is on the precipice of something new? What should they be doing broadly? What are some things they should be thinking about?

Tristan Norton:
For a new leader on the precipice of doing something like this, the first thing I would be is communication between you and your, I don’t want to say superior because that’s not the right word, but you and whoever’s in charge. If you’re an intern of the entire thing, great, make sure you have a clear vision of where you want to go and what you want to do. If you’re working with a team, I think over-communicating what you want the end goal to be, over communicating what small short goals would be. And then over-communicating timeframe and how you want to do it. I think once communication is clear and it’s probably something that we learned in a lot of our leadership classes, you can never over-communicate something, especially when you want to get things done, that it will be very helpful. Setting up a really good business plan and making sure these goals are attainable is another thing I would suggest, especially if it’s a new pilot project. I wouldn’t say bite off too much that you can chew right at the beginning.

Tristan Norton:
Like it would be good to have really great lofty goals, five-year, ten-year goals, but set up a list that you’re like, “Okay, in the first three months, this is what we’ll do. In the first six months, this is where I need to be. In the first year, this is what I can do. But also give you room for failure and to be able to shift and change those goals on the fly because as we see, no one thought we would be in a lockdown for a year and a week now. So looking forward in hindsight, it’s good to be flexible, knowing that we could end up in another pandemic in the next year and a half, who knows. But just being willing to shift and change and adapt on the fly, I think, is some of the key things I would encourage people to do.

Mathieu Yuill:
Right. Yeah. If there’s going to be another pandemic, it’s definitely going to be somebody from Newfoundland kissing a fish. That already happens there. No, I’m only teasing my Newfoundland friends. But you’re 100% right. We don’t know. So in creating this online learning at Briercrest, what was one thing you over-communicated? And I ask this because every week a client says to me, “I want to do online training.” Every week. So what is one thing you’ve been over-communicating as you journey on this?

Tristan Norton:
I think I’ve been over-communicating the need for promotion, just promoting it to get it out there. And in all honesty, I probably haven’t done a great job at communicating that. But that’s probably one of the biggest things that I did communicate. It’s easy for me to build relationships with content creators, because I think I’m just personable and it’s easy that way. And I have had great support from leadership here saying, “Just run with it. Just do what we need to get done.” And anything I’ve taken to my supervisor, he’s been like, “Oh, this looks great.” And he’s right, it does look great because we have worked with some great creators. So that’s been great, the support’s been great. But I think what we lacked was just a promotion. And I think I communicated it a little bit, but I could have done a little bit better at communicating that part. So yeah, the promotion part is the part I think.

Mathieu Yuill:
That’s a great point. And as you were saying that, I was thinking of one client in particular, that’s doing internal training. So it’s not about promotion in terms of, “Oh, you got to sign up for this.” But I think the over-communication is, here are the benefits for you as an employee for participating in this. And let’s run out one of these old tropes, right? If it’s worth doing, it’s worth doing well.

Tristan Norton:
Yeah.

Mathieu Yuill:
So if you’ve put some good effort into creating the content, then definitely you should probably match that for the communications aspect. I want to pump it up, man. There’s four courses online right now, myself and three others. I’ve done two of them already. I’m going to sign up for the third one today for 60 bucks. I think in the show notes, we might have a discount code for you, I’ll talk to Tristan about that after. But I’m sure we can get one.

Tristan Norton:
Oh yeah.

Mathieu Yuill:
They’re so good. The one I watch on technology in theology, it just really opened my mind to the way we interact on an intrinsically way with our tech and made me think about the way I interact with it with my colleagues, with my children. Check it out, it’s well worth it. And I’ve gone back. What I love about the online delivery method too, is I watch the whole thing, but then there’s a few lessons that I go and rewatch because I want to hear it again. And what I love about these platforms is you can actually run things at two times the speed.

Tristan Norton:
Yeah. So if you’re busy doing something, you can just play it in the background.

Mathieu Yuill:
Yeah. Once you’ve heard it once, you just want to hear it again. I think listening to it in real time is important because you get, the speaker might want to emphasize something. But anyhow.

Tristan Norton:
Yeah. Another thing I would tell someone who is on the verge of starting like this, go at your gut feeling. If you’re creative and you have a feeling of like, “Oh man, this could work,” just do it. And two things can happen. Well, three things. You can succeed or you can just be delayed or you can fail. And if you fail, you know what you did wrong and you just do it better the next time.

Tristan Norton:
And I think a lesson that I learned was that I didn’t take as many chances as I could have. Like a lot of things, I was just like, “Oh man, should I do this? Should I not do this?” But one of the things I learned is that I should’ve just done it. And because it’s so easy to get in that mindset of like, “Oh man, what if I fail? What’s going to happen?” If your supervisors have trusted you enough to give you these programs to do, they already see your talent, so might as well just run with it and see how you can learn from that. So that’s just another thing, just do it.

Mathieu Yuill:
From my perspective, one of the qualities you bring to Briercrest is simply how you are not like most of the people who I’ve met, who worked there. We talk about this, you’re a city guy. It’s funny, I’ve been trying to think about, you’re a city guy, but also like in a farming area, you’re a guy who loves sneakers, right?

Tristan Norton:
Oh yeah.

Mathieu Yuill:
Probably not a lot of sneakerheads, right, around you? But you bring this, such a different perspective. So you’re a city guy working in a small town. You’re in your thirties where many Briercrest employees are in their late forties and older. And we’ve joked about this. You were the only non-white guy in all but one of our classes.

Tristan Norton:
This is true.

Mathieu Yuill:
There are two non white guys, that was it, we doubled it, like 100% increase. And we laughed about it, but in leadership, the different perspectives are so important. So pros of the different ways of thinking and life experiences you’ve had in your world. And so what I want people to take away from this is you’re going to tell your story, but I want them to start thinking about like, “Okay, what can I be looking for in somebody who’s different than me?” What are some pros that way?

Tristan Norton:
Some pros or different cultural perspective, not just cultural or racial perspective, because yes, I am Afro-Caribbean. I grew up in the Caribbean and I am black. So that’s different, very different than being African-American. So I think the racial diversity is there. Also just the cultural diversity, the way I was raised and the way I was brought up is probably a lot different than a lot of people here. So I think being able to bring that conversation into a lot of my classes, into the workspace, it was really, I think, that was a big pro in that way. I know when a lot of the racial tensions were happening on social media and the internet and everywhere that I had a lot of very pointed and deep conversations, not just with students on campus, but also with coworkers that I thought was very helpful.

Tristan Norton:
And it was a pro in the sense that I wasn’t trying to teach them new things because they realized that I wasn’t the answer for all black people. They just had certain questions, and I’m really thankful that a lot of them realized that. So we just had open, honest conversations in a way that I think hasn’t been able to be done before. So I really enjoyed that. There were a few conversations which were tough to have, and in any workplace that will happen. But I think some of the pros that I brought where I am different racially, I have been brought up differently, culturally. I am, like you said, a lot younger than a lot of different staff members here. So just the way we do certain things, I think that helped. And just being able to communicate with even students on a different level than some of the older staff or older professors was, I think, very helpful for our seminary team.

Mathieu Yuill:
I want to highlight one of the things you said. My friend, I’m going to give her a shout out, Reshika, told me this probably 15 years ago. I was at Centennial College at the time and I was running, I restarted this evening called an evening of inspiration for women in the workforce or something. I forgot exactly what I called it. But my mom was an entrepreneur and my two sisters, both successful in their fields and are both entrepreneurs as well. And so I wanted to honor them by putting together this thing. And so we run this evening where we’d have a speaker come in and just talk about what’s it like to be a woman business leader. I remember Reshika was at this event and we were talking and her heritage is South Asian. And I remember asked her something about that.

Mathieu Yuill:
And she’s like, “That’s just my opinion. I don’t speak for all the nation.” And I was like, I didn’t realize that what I was asking was actually asking her that. You know what I mean?

Tristan Norton:
Yeah. Mm-hmm (affirmative).

Mathieu Yuill:
I wasn’t asking her to be like, “Can you speak on behalf of a billion people?” But I was asking her that and I was like, “Oh man.” So I really appreciate that. She opened my eyes to just that ignorance. And it’s been so helpful ever since that, like what it’s taught me. And I just wanted to highlight this if you’re listening, is that you are talking to one person, right?

Tristan Norton:
Yeah.

Mathieu Yuill:
And just appreciate that, come with that mindset that this is an individual’s take on this matter. I follow Chuck D on social, right, from Public Enemy.

Tristan Norton:
Yeah.

Mathieu Yuill:
For those of you who don’t know tho that is.

Tristan Norton:
I’m like, he’s going to say this and not a lot of people are going to know who Chuck D is.

Mathieu Yuill:
He’s an amazing speaker. So he posts about a lot of social issues. But again, I can go down my feed and find somebody that might look and sound like him, but has a very different opinion. And so the important thing to remember is that he’s not speaking on behalf of but he’s bringing education awareness.

Tristan Norton:
Yeah.

Mathieu Yuill:
So out of all you just said to me, that’s what I wanted to highlight.

Tristan Norton:
And for me it was, growing up in the Caribbean is definitely different than growing up in America or Canada. I grew up in St. Vincent, in the Grenadines. So I grew up in a predominantly black country. Yes, there were people that were Caucasian or different races, but most of the people I grew up with, looked like me. So even when I moved to the states, because I went to school in the states for four years and experienced any racial tension, it was there, but I guess it phased me, but it didn’t phase me as much as a lot of my family members that grew up in the states or grew up in Canada. And it wasn’t until recently, maybe three years ago when I realized, “Man, that was bad what these people did,” thinking about him just like, “Yeah, that wasn’t right. That wasn’t kosher. Like what?”

Tristan Norton:
And it just took so long for me to clue in and key into what was happening because growing up, I can’t remember any time from the age of six to 18 years of age where I experienced anything bad in the Caribbean. It might’ve happened. But because all my friends looked at me, I didn’t like key in or clue in. It’s only since I’ve moved to North America, that I have more recognizing what’s happening. And that’s why I think my perspective is so different in that I grew up differently. Even though I am black, my experience as a black man is different than the experience of someone in the states or someone in Canada.

Mathieu Yuill:
So the title of this podcast will be like, Everybody is Different. And I know we laugh about it, but I think we need to hear this right now as well, too. Right?

Tristan Norton:
Yeah.

Mathieu Yuill:
So we kind of start touching into it. What are some of the cons of being different? For people that don’t live in a community where they are the different one, I want to be bringing awareness for them. That’s what I’m hoping you can help listeners with right now.

Tristan Norton:
Living in, would this be considered rural Saskatchewan, I guess?

Mathieu Yuill:
Dude, dude.

Tristan Norton:
Yeah.

Mathieu Yuill:
Your internet comes via telegram. All right? Yes, it’s rural Saskatchewan.

Tristan Norton:
Cons. I still get stared at, in the grocery stores.

Mathieu Yuill:
Really?

Tristan Norton:
Yeah. Yeah.

Mathieu Yuill:
You know what’s funny? When I remember when Alison, my wife, asked me when I first went, she’s like, “What is it like?” I said, “I went shopping at eight o’clock when I landed on the Sunday.” And in Toronto, there’s just not the same First Nations population. And I was like, I’ve never seen so many people from First Nations community. And so I probably was staring too, because I had never. Anyhow, so interesting that you are getting stared. I get it, I get it. But I thought they’d be more accustomed to it.

Tristan Norton:
If Cori and I, my wife, she’s white, you’ve met Cori. If we’re having supper out in town, it’s different than if we’re having supper in Regina or Saskatoon. So even if I go to the mall in Regina and Saskatoon, it’s different than if I go to the mall here in town.

Mathieu Yuill:
Right.

Tristan Norton:
And that’s just small town, that’s just the way it is. I’m not saying that’s right, but that’s what happens. So that’s a con. When people ask questions that are general about black culture and I’m like-

Mathieu Yuill:
Like you’re the spokesperson.

Tristan Norton:
Yeah. I’m like, “I don’t know.”

Mathieu Yuill:
Yeah. Like, did Nelson Mandela come and knight you or something. Is that how it works?

Tristan Norton:
I did not grow up in Canada. It hasn’t really happened. I haven’t really had a lot of bad experiences being here.

Mathieu Yuill:
Well, I think one of the keys is that, I actually hear this quite often because I’ve been asking these questions a lot and I hear this all, like it was not bad, but dude, being stared at, at a grocery store, that’s something that we can, that helps me.

Tristan Norton:
Yeah, yeah.

Mathieu Yuill:
Do I do that? Have I done that? Because it’s not good. Trust me. If I was being stared at a grocery store, I’d be tweeting about it and being like, “Who does this person think they are staring at me?” You know what I mean?

Tristan Norton:
Okay. But see, I won’t tweet about it out of fear to being called, “Oh, there’s another angry black man.”

Mathieu Yuill:
100%. What I was reflecting on is that how easy I would have it all about behavior where you’re justifying that it’s not that bad, where I’m going to say no, it is that bad.

Tristan Norton:
Yeah.

Mathieu Yuill:
Let me say this. My friends in Moose Jaw, please don’t stare at Tristan in the grocery store. Go on. Sorry, go on.

Tristan Norton:
For the most part, no, not for the most part, I love Briercrest, I love Saskatchewan, I love Moose Jaw. But I think what has happened is that people in this area would consider themselves very conservative. So what I’ve noticed is that a lot of individuals that put that label on them, they’re not pacifist, but they also don’t like seeking out confrontation. So they will do everything to not be called racist or any derogatory term. And then it sometimes comes off as being just a little bit too weird because you’re trying so hard. And then they end up doing things that are more detrimental instead of just owning the fact that everyone is different and we need to learn how to live with these differences and not isolate anyone. So I think in my workplace it’s been great because a lot of people are recognizing that and are asking questions and are trying to speak up and figure out what’s different. And when I say workplace, I mean the people I work closely with, like the seminary team.

Mathieu Yuill:
Yeah.

Tristan Norton:
That’s who I interact with on a daily basis. So I really appreciate that. And I really appreciate what the counseling center has been doing here at Briercrest. Not just because my wife’s a counseling student, but they have made it a safe place for people to talk about a lot of different things. And I think that they’re doing a good job at that as well. In the city we live in, the town we live in, I have a lot of friends that aren’t black and they started asking more questions after the George Floyd incident was aired all over television. And the questions they asked I thought were very helpful because they realized that stuff is still happening that people of color have no control over, but yet we still have to live with and try and mentally struggle through it on a daily basis.

Tristan Norton:
So a lot of them were just asking like, first of all, a lot of them asked how I felt, which was very good that they’re actually concerned about that. But in the same time, the admittedly didn’t understand. So I appreciate when they’re like, “I just don’t understand.” I’m like, “Yeah, you will never fully understand and I’m glad you recognize that. But do you want to be better?” And I think a lot of them do and have been making steps to become better in that aspect. So you’re right. It is not great that I get stared up at, at grocery stores and restaurants and it sucks and it’s something that we need to change. But I think there’s a handful of people out there that are trying to change it.

Mathieu Yuill:
One thing I’ve learned, I’ve had to really eat a lot of humble pie personally, and just I’ve been asking my friends, is some of my behavior or things I’ve asked or assumptions I made hurtful. And you’re thinking like, “Oh, why are you doing that?” Let me give you an example of a conversation I just recently had. I grew up with a girl, a woman I’ve known her since grade three, right? So long time. And I knew her as, I’m not sure if she’d like me calling her by name. So I won’t call her by name. So I knew her as Rachel and her parents were born in Hong Kong. Either she was born there and moved her and she was very young, like one or she was born here. I forget which.

Mathieu Yuill:
But in her twenties for her public facing, she started using her name that’s on her birth certificate. So that was 20 years ago. And so just recently, we were on the phone, I said, “I have to apologize. I’ve never called you that. But I know when I meet somebody who’s met you in the past 20 years, they call you that. I’m sorry if that’s been hurtful to you. Should I be calling you that?” And I fully expected her to say yes, like “Come on Mathieu, this is what I’ve been calling myself for 20 years. It’s on my business card, it’s on my LinkedIn, et cetera.” But what she said, she’s like, “Actually, I don’t know. I’ve known you for more than half my life as Rachel. My parents call me Rachel. I don’t know.” And I was like, “Oh, man.” First of all, here I am. It was hard for me to ask her that because it would’ve meant that for 20 years, I’ve been doing something that’s bad. Right?

Tristan Norton:
Yeah.

Mathieu Yuill:
I don’t want to do that to myself. Then I made an assumption that she would want that. And what was her response? “I don’t know.” And she’s like, “Just keep calling me Rachel actually for now. And so I’ll let you know.”

Tristan Norton:
Yeah.

Mathieu Yuill:
So the learning takeaway from what you just said, and for me is, you just have to ask.

Tristan Norton:
Oh, yeah.

Mathieu Yuill:
And if you come with authenticity, think about for yourself if you’re listening. What’s something that somebody has asked you genuinely that you’re like, “Man, thank you so much for asking. And yeah, please stop doing that because it is very hurtful.”

Tristan Norton:
Yeah. People just don’t ask because, like you just said something, I don’t want to admit I’ve been doing something wrong for so long.

Mathieu Yuill:
Yeah.

Tristan Norton:
That’s why people don’t ask and they don’t ask and they’re like, “Okay, I’ll just change.” So they don’t ask and they change without asking. And you’re just like, “Why are you doing this?”

Mathieu Yuill:
Yeah.

Tristan Norton:
This is more awkward than if you had just asked me.

Mathieu Yuill:
Yes.

Tristan Norton:
And I think, not just Caucasian people, but I think everyone, every race is just scared to ask because as people in general, we don’t like conflict.

Mathieu Yuill:
Yes.

Tristan Norton:
And I think people of color, especially are scared to ask because we’ll be considered people that are stirring the pot, but also is just worse for us when we ask these questions, which is very disgusting to me, I think, that we’re scared to stand up for ourselves because we’ll be called the angry black man or the angry black woman, because we are not accepting or being glad for what we have, which I’m like, no.

Mathieu Yuill:
And I think of my sisters, right? I had male bosses that have been total jerk faces, and they would wrap it in, “This is the way I motivate you.” Well, if my sisters acted that way, they would get called horrible names.

Tristan Norton:
Oh yeah.

Mathieu Yuill:
Not just people of color, it’s gender as well. And so I want to ask you this then, because man, one of my favorite things of our friendship is just the way we riff like this because I learn so much from you. I did graduate summa cum laude, but I’ve learned a lot. I’m not even sure if I said it right. It’s on my diploma though, or my degree, so I got to say it out loud. But I have learned a lot from you as a classmate, in the course, and just like talking in the group discussions. And we actually did speak a lot about racial diversity. And I’m not sure if that’s because I was one of the more obvious outsiders being from Toronto coming to Saskatchewan.

Mathieu Yuill:
And I said it before, I’m a middle-aged white guy and I don’t know what it’s like not to be, like I just don’t know. Stephen Covey who wrote the 7 Habits of Highly Effective People, he says this and I love it. He says, “To know something but not to do it is simply not to know it.”

Tristan Norton:
Yeah.

Mathieu Yuill:
So I often sit with clients saying, “Listen, if you say you’re a diverse company and you don’t have one person who doesn’t look like you on here, then you’re not diverse. You might say you are. But if you’re not doing it, you’re not.” I’m going to ask you for some more help as we finish off here. We’re both educated, we’re similar age, we’re both men. But what do you face that is extra? And I want to know, and it’s not something that has to be all bad. But the bad and the good, I want you to know so I can be conscious of this and it’ll influence and impact my decision-making.

Tristan Norton:
Right. So for me, something that I know I personally faced that’s extra is I think my life for the last 15 years has been very performative, but not performative in a bad way, but performative in a self-preservation kind of way. I grew up with an accent. When I talk to my family members, I have an accent, it comes out. But I learned early on that I was really annoyed every time people were like, “Hey, can you repeat that? I just don’t understand,” or “Hey, can you talk American?” or “Hey, can you talk Canadian so we can figure this out?” So I think the extra thing that I have that you won’t have is that I have to try really hard to be accepted. I have to try really hard at the things I say, the way I act, the way I drive.

Tristan Norton:
I just have to try so much extra to not put myself in a situation where I could come off as being aggressive or different or less than which sucks that you have to try so hard every day, because people always question, “Why are you doing that? Why are you saying this? Why are you dressed this way? Why are you talking like this?” Whereas a lot of my white friends, they don’t have to deal with that. It’s just like, he’s white, he’s Canadian, he’s white, he’s American, this is just who they are. Whereas people of color, not just black people I think, all people of color, have to try so hard to be accepted or taken seriously because we’re just different. And I know there’s been a lot of social activism, a lot of people trying to change that narrative, but I still think we have a long way to go.

Mathieu Yuill:
That’s actually put an idea in my head. I’m going to say it out loud for the first time. One of the things I’ve been trying to figure out is I want to be bringing on a couple of new staff. Positions don’t exist but we’re going to create them, bring them on. And I’ve been trying to think of how do I hire and ensure that even unconscious bias doesn’t come through. And so I’ve been trying to figure out a system and to let people apply so their name, their image, anything that might hint towards, doesn’t matter if they can do the job or not.

Tristan Norton:
Yeah, yeah.

Mathieu Yuill:
And so when you say that, it’s like, okay, that actually kind of affirms that, okay, I need to work really hard on figuring out how that is going to work. I’m probably going to engage my friend Reshika, who I mentioned earlier, to help me figure out how do you do that? Because the most recent I’d hired, most applicants came through LinkedIn and I might as well be invited to their house for dinner. You know what I mean? I know you could find out so much about people.

Tristan Norton:
Yeah, yeah.

Mathieu Yuill:
Is that a good thing, I don’t know if it’s helpful. I don’t know. Anyhow. I try to keep these to be 30 minutes, but this has been very good, so we’re eight minutes over. So thank you home listener for sticking with us. But I think it’s obvious to recognize the intrinsic value Tristan’s brought today. But listen, before you go, I mentioned it a couple of times, you’re a sneaker head. And so I need to know if one thing people can take away from this and they want to get a fresh pair of kicks. Give me a couple of recommendations. What should people be looking for coming down the pipeline?

Tristan Norton:
Coming down the pipeline.

Mathieu Yuill:
People must ask you this all the time. Because that’s the first thing I said to you, it was like day three of one of our classes. And I was like, “Every pair of shoes you have are amazing and they’re different every day.” I think that’s what I asked you, or something.

Tristan Norton:
Oh man. I think for me, a classic silhouette is the Jordan 1.

Mathieu Yuill:
Okay.

Tristan Norton:
I know there’s a lot of funky colors out there that people are into, but right now the one I wear most often is called the Jordan 1 Retro High Gym Red. It’s black, white, and red and it’s a clean silhouette. You can wear it with whatever. And the only thing about sneakers though is that sneakers are getting very expensive.

Mathieu Yuill:
Yes.

Tristan Norton:
So if you have the budget and you want to buy a clean shoe, I would suggest getting the Jordan 1 High. It’s called the 85 and it’s just a white and gray shoe. It’s super clean. You can wear it with pretty much anything. But be prepared to spend a couple hundred dollars.

Mathieu Yuill:
Right?

Tristan Norton:
If you’re in the sneakers, it’ll be fine.

Mathieu Yuill:
Yeah.

Tristan Norton:
If you’re not in the sneakers, I’m sorry.

Mathieu Yuill:
I was actually going to engage you because I want to buy, I tried to get them when they’re available but I couldn’t, the Adidas Terry Fox.

Tristan Norton:
Yep. Yep.

Mathieu Yuill:
Adidas have the Terry Fox shoe. I want to try to find that.

Tristan Norton:
Pretty sure I could find that. Yeah, those Terry Fox shoes, the 40th anniversary, cheapest pair right now $300.70 cents.

Mathieu Yuill:
Oh my gosh. You know what I love about Terry Fox is that he had something that he wanted to talk about and he just did it.

Tristan Norton:
Oh yeah.

Mathieu Yuill:
He didn’t wait for permission, didn’t wait for sponsorship, didn’t wait for anything, he just did it. Now some, not every time. But sometimes in business, if you believe in it in your heart, you just need to do it. And listen dude, before we go, if people want to find out more, where do we send them for Briercrest? Where can they go to learn more about some of the stuff we talked about today?

Tristan Norton:
If they want to know more about those online classes, they just need to go to briercrest.online. And the four courses are there and they can email me from that website as well or if they go to briercrest.ca and just search in center for leadership studies, it’ll take them to a page as well. But to get to the courses, to sign up, briercrest.online. And even on Instagram, there’s the Briercrest Seminary is also on Instagram.

Mathieu Yuill:
And we’ll have a discount code for any course listed in the show notes, wherever you’re listening. And if you do, I don’t know if you know this or not, but if you sign up for the communicated and crisis course, we actually give you a half an hour free consultation. We can talk about any communications problem you have. And usually in a half an hour, we can figure out a plan for you to execute on something. Tristan, man thanks so much for being on today, man. This was gold. I loved it all.

Tristan Norton:
Thanks for having me, man. It’s always awesome catching up and chatting. And the next time we’re in Ontario, Mississauga area, we’ll go down to the Footlocker power house downtown and pick you up some kicks..

Mathieu Yuill:
Dude, 100%, man. 100%. I would love that.

Tristan Norton:
Oh, before I go, if you like old school shoes, those Reebok Pumps are re-releasing this month at Foot Locker.

Mathieu Yuill:
Oh my gosh, I remember those. I had a friend in public school, he had [inaudible 00:37:39]. Dan had a pair. Well listen, before we go though, I do have to say, I want to say thank you to those people that helped make this happen. Carrie Cotton’s our account manager. And if you hear background notifications on my computer, that’s Carrie. She does work so I can stay on chat with you. Naomi is my EA and she helps me prepare for this, she reminds me of the show up, all that stuff. Jamie hunter, if you’ve heard about this on social or you saw our blog posts, you can thank him. He takes care of our content, makes sure this gets published and upload it to the podcast platforms and writes blog posts and promotes it. Cindy Crake, she books a guest, she coordinates with them, sets the time. And Austin Pomeroy is our audio, I don’t know exactly what to call him, audio producer, audio technical person. I don’t know, but dude is super solid man. I’m so grateful for him.

Mathieu Yuill:
So anyhow, thank you. Oh look, an as I’m talking, Carrie’s texted me with, “Here’s what I need you to do for me.” So thank you Carrie.

Tristan Norton:
And before you go, I just to say very sorry, Cindy, for taking so long to get that bio and headshot in. Next time I’ll be on it.

Mathieu Yuill:
Have you earned a next time in the podcast? We’ll find out.

Tristan Norton:
I’m hoping, I’m hoping.

Mathieu Yuill:
Season two. Dude, thanks very much. Have a great day. For more on this, leadingwithnice.com. We’ll talk to you again soon.